Monday, June 18, 2012
Catcher in the Rye 2011-2012
Boy, oh, boy ladies & gents! We sure had a good time reading this feel good story in class. There are so many different interesting & intriguing things to talk about, when it comes to this story. I'm sure all of you would like the opportunity to share your thoughts on a few topics with the blogophere. Comment below on anything you found interesting in the book.
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Oh, Mister Hartshorn! I'm going to miss you SO much. You are the best . . . . . . except for the smell.
ReplyDeleteHey, Mr. Hartshorn, this is Darren Lozada. I didn’t really enjoy reading Catcher in the Rye but there were some interesting things that I’d like to talk about.
ReplyDeleteFirst off, I think that the reason Holden felt less depressed when he heard the child sing is because a child in the book represents innocence and throughout the book. Holden has been dealing with people who were phonies so when he saw this child singing it made him feel better and less depressed. for Holden, every single child isn’t a phony. Holden wants to keep innocence of a child and be the “Catcher in the Rye,” the rye represents a field of innocence and he just wants keep the children from going through adulthood and being a phony. That’s why Holden felt less depressed, because he thought that there is hope that he can prevent children from falling into adulthood which is inevitable.
Second thing I would like to talk about is that Holden only chose to say that he likes the nuns and James Castle because he thinks that they aren’t phonies. The rest of the people or things he could think about were all phonies since he thinks that he is surrounded by them. Holden couldn’t think of anything that he actually liked because Phoebe was right, she said, “You don’t like anything that’s happening.” Which is true because throughout the book, all Holden talks about are the things around him and how these things depress him, and a lot of things even the smallest things depress him so easily.
The last thing I would like to talk about is how Holden agrees to write a composition for Stradlater. He agreed to writes Stradlater a composition because he didn’t have anything to do at Pency. Holden also didn’t like the fact that he couldn’t stop thinking about Jane Gallagher, so to get himself to stop thinking about how might Stradlater treated or what Stradlater did to JaneGallagher he wanted to do something to get them out of his head. Holden was even glad when Ackley came back to his room after Stradlater had left to his date. Holden doesn’t even like Ackley, but he was glad that Ackley had come to his dorm room because Holden just didn’t awnt to think about Jane Gallagher the whole time that Stradlater was out with her.
Hey Mr.Hartshorn this is Trayvon Jones and i will like to discuss my understanding between Holdens relationship between Allie and Jane is that holden wants to keep his memories of Jane as a child, because he knows if he contacts her that she will automatically become a "phony". But only because Jane has grown up and thinks that kids are the only ones who aren't "phony", like Allie, he would never consider Allie as a phony because he will always be a child. Allie always made Holden laugh and made him happy just like Jane did when they were kids. But now that he knows Jane has grown up and all Holden is afraid of any contact with her.
ReplyDeleteSecondly, I believe the real reason for Holden not wanting to make contact with her is because she has grown up. Holden and Jane were really good friends during there childhood, i believe that Holden loved Jane. When Jane was going on a date with stradlater Holden did not go down stairs to say hi to her because he knew that Jane wouldn't be the same as she was before when she was a kid. Holden doesnt want to lose that chidly image of her having the personality and other traits as a kid. So Holden procrastinates to make contact with her. Another reason Holden wont talk to her is because the things she might have done with Stradlater in the back of Ole Ed Banky's car.
Lastly, I think the significance of Holden wanting to be the "catcher in the rye" is that Holden wants to catch all the kids from falling off the cliff to adulthood. In Holdens eyes he believes that all adults are phony, and that all kids will never be phony, until the grow up. Thats why Holden keeps the red trucker hat, to resemble the childhood of his brother Allie. This is why Holden also keeps other childish things, and gets happy when childish things occur. Deep down Holden wants to be a kid again, but doesn't realize or doesn't except the fact that he is becoming an adult and will never be able to admit it. He shows that he is maturing by turning down the carrousel ride with Phoebe, and says that if she falls i cant catch her, which means that they are both going to grow up no matter how hard he tries.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn its Kamron Ho, I was scrolling through your blog and thought it was very eye opening. I wanted to share a few of my thoughts on The Catcher In The Rye . While I was reading I first noticed Holden enjoys reading children’s school notebooks. At first I thought it was weird but caught on to what was happening in the book. Holden enjoys reading kids notebooks because I believe it entertains him. I also believe it could bring back his childhood. Maybe he had a notebook like that back in the day. He might just want to get a look in to a child’s mind for a while. Holden said he could read them all day and night. I think Holden just wants to see how much children changed since he was a child. That is my thoughts on Holden reading kids notebooks.
ReplyDeleteSecond, I was confused whether or not Holden actually cared about the ducks welfare at central park during the winter. I figured that Holden is concerned about the welfare of the ducks. The reason why is because maybe that is just something he wanted to know the answer to . It could also mean he is like one of these ducks, and he just wants to find out where he needs to go in life. He is stuck at a stage in life where change is coming, and he does he’s not quite ready for it though. So he is trying to use the duck story to find some guidance on what to do next. That is what I think about Holden and the ducks at Central Park.
Lastly, in the story Dr. Thurmer states the concept of life being a “game”. My thoughts on Dr. Thurmer is you have to play by the rules and I agree in that. You can’t cheat your way through life. If you do you can only get so far with taking the easy way out. You would just need to know the game, rules, and just be the best at that game to make something of yourself. You would just have to keep fighting to get where you want to be. Also you have to do it fairly in every way. That is why I agree with Dr. Thurmer’s life as a “game” concept. Those were a few of my thoughts on the book, and I enjoyed this book very much.
Hello mister Hartshorn, this is Carlos Aviles. This past year we have read many stories but one story that interested me in a few ways was Catcher in the Rye. The few ways that this story interested me was because Holden is a very curious character. Holden enjoys reading children’s notebook or any ones notebook in general. He can read that kind of stuff all day and all night. It killed him to read that kind of stuff. I believe he enjoys reading other people’s notebook because it can tell you a lot about that person. Holden wants everyone to stay innocent like a child but nobody ever does because eventually people grow up and become adults. The notebook helps Holden figure out if their phonies. Holden says that it kills him to read a child’s notebook but he can read it all day and all night. After I read this for some minutes it was kind of hard to understand Holden. Holden is hard to understand.
ReplyDeleteAnother reason of why it caught my interest was Holden’s reason of why he decides he’s not in the mood to call Jane Gallagher because when he met her, which was when they were children. What Holden remembers about Jane, he pictures her being innocent and not being a phony. Holden only remembers the good times that he had with Jane. He thought she was innocent which he liked about her. He doesn’t want to see her because he wants her to no change her appearance he has of her. He knows her at being innocent and if he sees her than that might change Holden’s view of her being innocent and not a phony because he hasn’t seen her in some time.
The final reason that this story interested me was because Holden thins that many people are phonies. He has this obsession because he obviously doesn’t think that people are innocent. He calls many people a bunch of phonies in the story when he doesn’t like something about the person. He calls people phonies for reasons that make no sense. Holden says one reason of why he doesn’t like the person when he is like the person. Maybe it can be that he knows he’s a phony and relates everyone to him when they are nothing like him. He doesn’t call children phonies throughout the whole story, especially his sister phoebe. Holden is confusing at times.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn, it’s Jessica Alcala. I was looking through your blog and I seen you had some information about the book Catcher In The Rye. I jotted down a few of my thoughts and views from when I previously read the book to share some of my information to you. So to start this off, Holden has always used the excuse of “not being in the mood”, for calling Jane Gallagher. The thoughts I came up with is Holden is ignoring her because he knows that Jane is not the same little girl he once knew back when he was young. Jane grew up and Holden does not want to see the new Jane. I think that he was scared to find out if she had grown up from the last time he saw her because he loved the old her. If he would’ve seen the new Jane all grown up, it would probably make him depressed. Depressed that she grew up and left her childhood, unlike himself. Holden does not want to let go of his childhood, he wants to live it.
ReplyDeleteSecond, as I was reading about Holden reading through Phoebe’s school notebook and saying he could read it all day, I knew there was something going on there. Holden enjoys reading kids notebooks because notebooks like that kill him. The reason why he could read them all day and all night is because he likes looking back at his childhood. I found out Holden is still in the process of not wanting to let go of his childhood, so I would say that he is still a child and that’s why he loves reading kids notebooks. Holden stated that he liked books that could make him laugh every once in a while. Kids notebooks aren’t boring, they’re filled with laughter and he could call that author up whenever he feels like it because they’re still kids.
Lastly, when I was reading about Stradlater using specific characteristics on his writing skills such as getting the commas in the right places it made me think about some of mine. I think some good characteristics of writing would be writing about something that really gets the persons attention. Another one would be having a good font and unique style of word font. Unique word font shows what kind of style the person likes and how classy or original the person wants there essay to be like. Another good characteristic I choose would be writing a good detailed introduction. A good introduction determines how good a person’s essay is going to be. One last characteristic for good writing would be writing what you feel, not no one else, but something you know real well. Basically writing about your interest. That is what would be my characteristics of good writing.
Hello Mr. Hartshorn, this is Jennifer Gomez. There are some topics I'd like to discuss about Holden’s obsession with phoniness develops and gets clearer as we read along the book. Hold feels as if he’s the only person that he’s met that is not a phony. With age comes phoniness for Holden. For example when he meets certain people he automatically thinks they’re gone. Why? because they’re already grown up. Holden thinks and sees the only people that aren’t phony are children. He sees them with good intentions and with a good heart. He likes to believe that kids can only be innocent like Jane Gallagher. He used to like her when they were both little. He wants to see her but at the same time he doesn’t because he doesn’t want to find out she’s a phony.
ReplyDeleteAnother event that I would like to discuss about Chapter 12 is when Holden becomes very depressed. One of the reasons why I think Holden became depressed was because he was always alone. In the beginning of the chapter all he can talk about is how alone he is. He starts to realize how lonely he’s become. Throughout the story, as Holden gets more depressed he starts to feel sorry for things. For instance, in this chapter he feels sorry for Ernie, the piano player. He also begins to lie more. Holden can lie a lot, like he can pretend to be super nice to you and hate your ways.
The final topic I would like to talk about is the conflict of sometimes feeling like a child and feeling like an adult can take a toll on someone. And in the book it’s Holden. For example, he can’t stand the fact that kids are not being innocent and should always do well. The thing is that his own sister Phoebe does things that aren’t good right in front of his face. Likewise, emotions such as betrayal run through Holden’s mind. He wants to be treated like an adult but is still suck in the mind set of being a little kid. Of himself being innocent and without ‘sin’. Teenagers do sometimes feel like being treated like adults because we aren’t as young anymore. We can do our own thing; we can cook, clean, and wash. On the other hand, when we get stuck or can’t do certain things, that’s; where we depend on our parents. And that’s the problem with Holden. He thinks he can do everything on his own, when he needs help.
Hi Mr. Hartshorn this is Phillip Kim. I'm going to miss your funny jokes. First, I would like to talk about is when in Ch. 4, according to Stradlater, “a good writing is simply putting commas in the right places”. I agree with Stradlater but his opinion is only a piece of good writing. In my view, some good characteristics on good writing are using high standard vocabulary so that you can inspire people through writing. When someone reviews your writing, he or she will acknowledge in how intelligent you are. Second, your thesis has to flow with your 3 paragraphs, you cannot have write about 1 paragraph about a different topic and two of the same topic. All three has to connect like a quilt. In writing, a writer should express their thoughts and feelings and talk about how that issue is contributing or changing society. The most important element in writing is that you have a conclusion stating the thesis and reasons why information you chose is important to the topic. Also, spelling is most common in essays, so always spell check. If possible, give statistics on the topic to help the reader understand your point of view. Lastly, to finish your essay, start off the conclusion with In Conclusion and state your thesis and facts you researched.
ReplyDeleteHolden, who is the main character, is telling the story in 1st person. When Holden was a kid, he wasn’t a phony but he admits that he when he grew up. Holden believes that everyone will become phonies unless someone catches the children that are playing in the rye field to prevent them from becoming phonies. Holden believed in this idea that from the poem “If a body meet a body coming through the rye” by Robert Burns said by Phoebe. Holden says on page 173 that he’ll have to” catch all everybody if they start to go over the cliff.” My thoughts on this is that Holden should be the catcher in the rye because he experienced what it’s like to be a kid and saw how people are phonies to become popular. Also, no one else but Holden will take the responsibility and protect the children. I think Holden wants to be the Catcher in the Rye because he realizes that he does not want children to be like him.
Lastly, I would like to talk about in the beginning of the book; Holden was desperate to talk someone. Holden enjoys talking to the nuns because he can say whatever to them without getting criticized or mad at someone .He wants to talk to someone who is mature and the nuns actually care for Holden when he donates $10 to them when they asked” are you sure you can afford it?”. One of the nun relates to Holden when then nun told Holden that she read Romeo and Juliet. She asked him if he enjoyed the book. He can also express is his thoughts on the book. Also, Holden says that the nun that teaches history was nice and reminded him of Mrs. Morrow. As the nuns were leaving, Holden said sorry for smoking but the two nuns were polite and nice about.
Dear Mr. Hartshorn this is Stephanie Gomez and yes, i have found many interesting things about this book one thing that i would like to point out is in Chapter eight Holden tells us he can go on lying for hours if he “feels” like it this makes us the readers worry. This is because he can be telling us lies throughout the book and us not even know it. While reading this book their were certain ares where I had to stop and think if Holden was lieing or not. This is a bad thing once you have discovered that someone has lied before because it makes you think that you can never believe what that person is telling you. I believe that throughout the whole story Holdens has lied to us numerous times. In my opinion i think Holden based the whole book on lies.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing that i found interesting was Holden tries to make contact with these three unsophisticated girls from the bar because he knows that nobody else would listen to him or hang out with him because they are too wrapped up in their own excitement. Holden also knows that these girls want the attention so hes going to give it to them. Holden also tries to make contact with the girls because he wants to hang out with somebody, in fact anybody. I think the fact that he spent time with the girls helped him and his depression because it helped not think about why hes so depressed and so on and so forth.
Lastly i would like to add my opinion on what i think the significance of the story is.I think the significance of Holden wanting to be the cather in the rye is how it symbolizes that he want to be the one to catch the kids before they reach adulthood or become “phonies”. Holden wants the children to remain how the are because he loves children but doesn’t like adults. Holden believes by being the catcher in the rye no child would have to leave their childhood and reach adulthood. What he wants to do is cath each and every child before they become adults. I myself find this to be quiet impossible, you cant prevent a person from reaching the stage of adulthood. However Holden doesn't realize this until the end. Holden states “ if they fall let them fall”. Here Holden had accepted the idea that he cant do anything about preventing the children from become adults.
Well hi Mister Hartshorn :)
ReplyDeleteThere are three topics I would like to talk about that I caught interesting in the book ...
In the book “The Catcher in the Rye” there are many situations in which Holden, the main character, has the chance to call Jane Gallagher, his childhood crush, but decides at the end not to. His reasoning behind this cowardly action in the book is because he is “not in the mood” to call her. I think that the reason why Holden doesn’t want to talk to her or avoids her is much further than the fact that he is a coward or that he is “not in the mood”. In this story the author makes it very clear that Holden wants to relive and stay in his childhood for he does not like adulthood because adults in his eyes are cowards, liars, evil, and phonies. Throughout the book Holden is criticizing adults and calling them phonies constantly. Holden is depressed in the book and the only thing that he has that makes him happy is Phoebe (his little sister) and his childhood memories, including the ones that involve Jane. After Holden hears that Jane messed around with Stradlater (his roommate) on their first date without leaving the parking lot, Holden is crushed and angry. I think Holden is afraid to find out first handedly what adulthood has done to the innocent Jane he felt in love with.
Something else that I think has a deep meaning in the book is Holden’s red Hunting hat. This hat is mentioned in the book a couple of times. It has been compared to Holden’s younger brother, Allie’s hair. Allie played an important person in Holden’s life and even after his death he still does. I think that hat represents his brother Allie and his childhood. The book leads to believe that it represented Allie when Holden mentioned that the color of the hat was similar to Allie’s hair color. I think it also represents his childhood as well. Tragically, Allie died from leukemia when he was still a kid. So I think when he puts on that hat not only does it remind him of Allie but it also allows him to pretend to be like Allie, a child.
Something that got my attention was when Stadlater said that good writing is simply a question of getting the commas in the right places. I actually really disagree with what Stradlater said. I don’t think that punctuation is what creates good writing. Don’t get me wrong, I think punctuation is important to help make good writing better because punctuation tells you how to read it. But the punctuation isn’t what makes people feel emotion for it is the words you chose to use and the way you decided to compose the sentence that determines whether it is good writing.
Sincerely,
Ana Cervantes XD
Hey Mr. hartshorn. i would like to give you my opinion on this book.
ReplyDeleteWell, Mr. Hartshorn, throughout the whole book Holden has been struggling with growing up and staying young. He loves and misses the things from his child hood, like, the museum he used to go to with his class as a kid. He likes it because it never changed, it always stayed the same. He doesn’t seem to adapt well with change, which is one of the reasons why Holden doesn’t want to grow up. So he sees that being the catcher in rye as saving children from becoming adults. He wants them to stay young and innocent forever. And being the catcher in the rye and stopping them before they “fall off ‘the cliff’ to adult hood” is what he wants to do and what he thinks is the right thing.
Also, When Holden was walking down the street from buying phoebe the CD “Little Shirley Beans” he came across a boy walking with his parents, the little boy was singing “if a body catch a body coming through the rye” when he hears it Holden becomes less depressed because he sees that he is still a pure and innocent child. It also gets him thinking about the rye as a cliff and the bottom of the cliff is adult hood. This makes him want to be the “catcher of the rye”, to keep them from becoming adults.
Last but not least. When Dr. Thurmer said that life is a game and you have to play by the rules to survive, I both agree and disagree. I agree because, well, many people play by the rules and they come out on top. But also just as many people don’t play by the rules and they come out higher than people who do. For example, Steve jobs the CEO of apple products and apple inc. he was a high school drop out and did illegal substances. Yet he became one of the richest guys in the world. And he didn’t play by the rules. But then again, bill gates also played by the rules, and still is the richest man alive because he created Microsoft products. So people can play against the rules or with the rules and still come out on top. In my opinion it doesn’t matter if you play by the rules or not as long as you follow your decision fully.
see above, Celina Lopez
ReplyDeleteHello Mr. Hartshorn, this is Berenice Garcia I actually really enjoyed reading The Catcher in the Rye. Here are some things that I'd like to discuss with you. Holden had talked so much about others and their non-experience with girls ,but when it came down to it he too was one of them. He was a virgin, he admitted it. As always though he'd back himself up though, with a big explanation on why he never came around to loosing his virginity. " Anyway, something always happens. I came quite close to doing it a couple of times though. " There is always an excuse for Holden no matter what it is. He explained how he always had " to stop " and he always did then regretting after that he had. He never knew if they really wanted it or not and at times he even felt sorry for them. to
ReplyDeleteHolden eventually doesn't care if he's found or not by his parents because that's actually exactly what he's wanted. He wanted to be home and safe with his famil. He actually really missed being with him and a lot of the simple things that came with them. Having a home cooked meal, knowing he has a place to stay, somewhere to sleep even was a relieve to him. He would rather get caught and be in so much trouble, but as long as he was home he knew he'd be okay.
Teenagers are in a ery complicated time in their life. Most of us are just trying to figure out what they need to do for everyone to be happy, but what they forget is even their own happiness. They base everything on how everyone else see's it, everyone is materialistic at times as well. We are young adults, but are expected to act like complete mature adults at times. That right there might as well just set us up for faulire. We are still learining many things and we all see things in a different perspective. We're stuck between being the young teen and the adult teen . We are expected to be both in one, something that I feel can be done. There is a right place and right time for everything. We all know we sometimes just want to stay young and not have to worry about adulthood, but it will come sooner or later.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn this is Jesse vega and I Have some interesting thoughts about The Cather in The Rye.This is Jesse Vega from Mr. Hartshorn's class and what i find interesting is Dr. Thurmer's concept about life being just a game. Dr. Thurmer discussed with Holden that your life is just a game and you have to play by the rules or you just end up losing, in this case Holden started to think like a madman. Through his eyes all Holden sees is phonies because when people talk he somehow knows it's not true and they're just faking it. What Holden doesn't see is that he is the biggest phony of them all, he doesn't play by any rules in his life. He just leaves school because he got kicked out for the third time, he just goes to a hotel for a while and ends up almost getting killed by Maurice. Holden’s life is a hard game that's going to get tough for him to play by the rules. He is now finding this out the hard way sitting inside a mental institute.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing that I have found interesting about why Holden always makes up an excuse not to call Jane, he is afraid. Holden doesn’t want to see Jane at all because as he has grown older he now sees everybody as a phony. The only people Holden does not think that are phonies is little kids. When Holden thinks about going to at least say hello to Jane when Stradlater mentions her he doesn’t want to. Holden won’t be able to see her as a young innocent girl as he remembers her. He will now see her as a great big phony just like everyone else. This is what I think the real reason Holden does not want to see her or talk to her.
Hello Mr. Hartshorn this is Maori Kahawaii and I want to thank you for allowing us to enjoy such an amazing book known as Catcher and the Rye I also would to have a input on the book.
ReplyDeleteI believe that although Holden would love to be more than just friends with ol’ Jane Gallagher he is just that “friends!” Holden likes to reminisce about the good old days and say, “I know old Jane like the back of my hand… the whole summer long we played tennis together almost every morning and got golf in the afternoon. I really got to know her quite intimately.” While he believes that he knows her like a book he seemed to forget or overlook the fact that people change and grow older, as well as mature. The Jane he once knew was now just a regular girl who did normal things. No longer his poster girl for Holden because he was no longer someone who was pure and untouched.
Secondly, the red hat to Holden symbolized Allie because to him, “people with read hair are supposed to get mad very easily, but Allie never did, and he had very red hair. He went on to say, “He was also the nicest in lots of ways. He never got mad at anybody.” The red hunting means to Holden everything that Allie stood for to him, which is pure and happy. The hunting hat gave Holden the sensation of not being a phony, which ultimately meant a lot to him. Lastly, Holden later gave the hat to Phoebe to somewhat protect her from becoming a phony, which further explains the symbolism behind the hat to Holden.
Lastly, Holden’s relationship related to Allie is one of pure admiration. According to Holden, Allie was a “good kid” a kid who instead of getting into trouble hit the books, a kid who instead of creating bad habits for himself made the most of his short life. Holden describes Allie as one of the few innocent and pure and intelligent as stated in this excerpt, “…he was about fifty times as intelligent. He was terrifically intelligent.” Also explained further by Holden, “he was also the nicest in lots of ways. He never got mad at anybody.” Holden’s relationship with Jane Gallagher was somewhat mirrored of Allie’s relationship with Holden. He also saw Jane as pure and not tampered with but a discussion between Holden and Stradlater, “Holden asked, what’d you do with ol’ Jane?” Stradlater replied by saying” give her the time in Ed Banky’s goddam car?” The discussion obstructed Holden’s reservations of Jane and made him question her pureness often throughout the book.
Hey Hartshorn, it’s Kelly Diaz from your 3rd period. There are a few things I found interesting on the book we read “The Catcher in the Rye.”
ReplyDeleteThe first thing I found interesting about this book was that Holden uses many excuses in many chapters not to talk to Jane Gallagher. I believe Holden uses the excuse that he isn’t in the mood to talk to Jane because he doesn’t want to face reality that she’s already turning into an adult. Adults to Holden are pure phonies. Holden remembers Jane Gallagher still being a child and he wants to keep it like that. If Holden talks to Jane on the phone, he’ll finally know that she’s not that child that he remembers playing checkers with when he was still a kid too and she has now turned into a phony like everyone else. Holden’s not ready to grow up yet and he doesn’t want Jane to do so either because he still wants her to keep her innocence. Instead of giving Jane a buzz, Holden thinks of giving this girl name Sally Hayes a call because he already knows that she’s a phony and it really doesn’t bother him as much as it would bother him knowing that Jane Gallagher is also beginning to turn into a phony like everyone else.
The second thing I found really interesting is how Holden has a special relationship with his brother Allie and Jane Gallagher. Holden loves his brother very much. Allie died of Leukemia when he was only 8 years old and Holden was 10. Holden and Allie’s relationship is strong because Allie will always remain a child and always keep his innocence instead of having to grow up and become a phony. Holden adores that. Holden and Jane also have a similar relationship as to the one Holden and Allie have. Jane is a childhood friend of Holden’s; he remembers her as a child and hasn’t seen her since. Even though Holden hasn’t talked to Jane, he wants to call her, but every time he makes up an excuse not to talk to her anymore. He’s still holding on to her as a child and doesn’t want to find out that she’s also growing up like himself.
The last thing that interested me was the significance of Holden wanting to be the catcher in the rye. While Holden was talking to his younger sister Phoebe, all he really had in mind was a song that went, “if a body meet a body coming through the rye.” Holden kept picturing all these little kids playing some game in this big field of rye and no grownups were around except for him standing on the edge of a cliff. His job was to catch all the little kids if they started to go over the cliff. I believe that Holden gave himself the job of being the catcher because he wants to save all the children from reaching adulthood. He wants them to maintain their innocence because if they fall into adulthood, they’re going to be phonies and Holden doesn’t want that to happen to the innocent kids.
Hello Mr. H. Its Nicolas Guzman. From reading the story catcher in the rye, i found a few interesting things that i would like to share with you.
ReplyDeleteThe first thing that actually caught my eye was Headmaster's view on life. He says life is a game. A game that you have to play according to the rules. In a way, I do agree with the headmaster's point of view. Most people go through life without actually living life. It's sad to say but thats the way it is. Life has many restrictions and rules that forbid you from reaching any type of goal that you might want to go for. It's sad to say. Holden on the other hand doesn't believe on life being a game and all. he states his reason, " If you get on the side where all the hot shots are, then its a game, but if you are on the other side, then whats the game about?" Holden's point of view is somewhat correct, but i see it as, it doesn't matter if your a hot shot or not, you do have to play by the rules. If you don't then you will punished on many different ways that you may not like. If you also do not play, then you are already playing the game.
Another thing that caught my eye was the fact that Holden would rather hang out with Sally Hayes than Jane. Throughout the whole story Holden comes up excuse after excuse on why he doesn't call Jane. In the story he talks about phonies and how he doesn't like them. He doesn't want to see a person he knew from a long time ago , to have grown up to be a phony. He doesn't want to see it. Thats why he rather not hang out with her. He knows Sally is a phony already and he kinda accepted it already.Its kind of funny that he rather hang out with a phony than an old friend. I think something is really wrong there, even for Holden.
What i also found interesting was the significance of Holden wanting to be the catcher in the rye. He explains it in great detail and its easy to imagine him being the catcher. As he explains it , its him in a big rye field, and there are a lot of little kids. A lot of kids, running and he's suppose to catch them before they fall off the cliff. In my point of view, i think this is the most important part of the whole story. Throughout the whole book, he's in a constant battle between phonies and himself. The only innocent ones where the children. They haven't really seen the real life yet and Holden thinks thats the best kind of person. He wants to prevent them before they fall off the cliff into adulthood. He's scared of the fact that people have to grow up and he doesn't want to grow up either. But sooner or later, he's going to have to grow up and follow the rules.
Thank you for letting my have the opportunity to have a chance to say what i feel about the book.
Hi Mr. Hartshorn this is Ashleean Oetjen and I actually found some interesting things about The Cather in The Rye. Here are some of the things that i found interesting: Holden and Allie are brothers but Holden is older by a few years. When the family was up in Maine Allie got leukemia and died on July 18, 1946. When Allie died Holden went psycho and broke all the windows on the station wagon. When Allie was alive he would go watch Holden tee off when he use to play golf. Holden and Jane Gallagher on the other hand are friends. Holden and Jane have not seen each other. When Holden use to play chess with Jane she would always keep her king in the back row. Holden is scared to see Jane again because he is afraid that she has become a phony just like everyone else.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing i found interesting was that Holden prefers to meet Sally Hayes instead of Jane Gallagher because Holden already knows that Sally is a phony. Holden does not want to take that chance and meet up with Jane to find out if she is a phony or not. Holden knows Sally likes to watch theater stuff because she likes literature and plays. Holden knows she a phony because when Holden called her the maid picked up then her father but she still asked who it was even though her father probably told her it was him. Holden also didn’t want to talk to Jane because he wasn’t sure if she was home yet from school.
The last thing i found interesting to me in the book was at the end of chapter 23 Holden no longer cares about being caught by his parents because if he was caught by his parents then he would have somewhere to stay and he didn’t have to jump around all over the place looking for somewhere to stay. Holden was also running out of money and felt bad that he took some money from Phoebe his little sister. Holden would also get to see his parents even thought he would get yelled at for getting kicked out of Pency Prep.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn, this is Jhaida Bailey. These are the things i found interesting.
ReplyDeleteFirst, holden is more of a phony than anyone who he thinks is being a phony. He thinks that all adults are phony mainly because they have to be able to cope with things and move on from them without dwelling on it. For example allies death, his parents are able to move past that and holden finds that phony. Holden is phony because he's trying to stick to his childhood ways when we all know he's a teenager. He's trying to be something he's not. it's funny that he cares for Jane Galleger but never goes up to talk to her or calls her. Him being phony overpowers his ability to be able to grow up. He is only close to children and its mainly because of allies death. The real question is when will Holden realize that the real phony is him?
Also, according to chapter 23, Holden and Phoebe were dancing around for about 4 songs. Then their mom came in and Holden hid in the closet when their mom left the room. When holden left he wished he had gotten caught. I think the real reason was because he had no money left. He asked Phoebe if she had any money left because he ran out. He really just wanted to come back home. He really missed phoebe and he was strait up broke.
Lastly i think the little boy singing the song made him think of allie. He said it made him less depressed. Allie died 3 years ago and maybe holden thinking about him makes thing better for him. We figured out that holden is trying to hold on to his childhood. He has some regrets and beats hisself up because of his brothers death. All adults are phony to him. In the book he never called a child phony. I t was always people his age or older. This is just my opinion, i hope it was helpful to you.
Good Morning Mr. Hartshorn it's Johanna Rivas (:
ReplyDeleteSomething i found interesting from this book was in chapter 5 I realized that the relationship Holden had with Jane Gallagher and Allie were much more different than the relationship he had with other characters in the story.Holden seems to have issues with everybody but when it comes to Jane Gallagher and Allie things are much different, he has nothing bad to say about them. Jane Gallagher is an old friend of Holden’s; he claims to know Jane very well saying “I know old Jane like a book”. Holden and Jane spent much time together playing sports and doing other things. Holden thinks Jane is pretty and in some way makes the reader believe they are something more than just friends “I held hands with her all the time”.Allie was Holden’s older brother. Allie passed away from leukemia he was very young. Allie in some way symbolizes youth and non phoniness. Holden never considered Jane or Allie a phony. Holden always has negative things to say about others but when it comes to Jane and Allie he has nothing but good memories of them. Holden cares deeply for Jane and Allie.
Another interesting thing from this book occurred in chapter 14 After the incident that occurred with Maurice and Sunny the prostitute. Holden makes up this fantasy about being shot by Maurice but, in reality Maurice only punched him. Holden imagined that after Maurice shot him after “getting shot” Holden got suited up went to the elevator after Maurice shot him six times while Maurice yelled “leave Me alone”. After shooting Maurice repeatedly Jane would come to Holden’s rescue and bandage him up and hold up a cigarette for him to smoke. Holden knows he’s not brave enough to confront Maurice so instead he makes up this fantasy about him being tough. In some weird way this fantasy cheers Holden’s up. For the first time in the story Holden admits to have issues “But I’m crazy, I swear to god I am”. Though he says this in a funny way this is where Holden actually realizes he's acting crazy.
The last interesting thing in this book in my opinion was the symbolic meaning of the red hunting hat.The red hunting hat is symbolic to Holden because this hat is a memory of Allie, his little brother. Allie had red hair. Allie is a symbol of youth, he died at a very young age, he wasn’t able to become an adult or what Holden considers a phony. When Holden wears this hat, he feels like things have not changed and he is still a kid and most importantly he feels like he isn’t a phony. We see the meaning this hat had to Holden during the last paragraph when he explains the moment when Phoebe, his younger sister places the hat on his head “then what she did- it damn near killed me- she reached in my coat pocket and took out my red hunting hat and put it on my head”. Holden had given his younger sister Phoebe the hunting hat maybe because he realized Phoebe was young and he realized it was time for him to grow up and whether he wore a hat or not nothing was going to change. Holden wanted to be a kid forever and for some reason this hat gave Allie’s youth to Holden. This hat was meaningful because Holden felt like in it he was a kid and not a phony.
Hello Mr. Hartshorn, this is Katelyn Mendez. After reading this book, Catcher in the Rye, I found some interesting things that I’d like to share with you.
ReplyDeleteOne thing I found interesting was that, throughout the book it is well known that Holden’s’ best and positive moments occur with people who are still connected to their innocents; children and youth. It is better understood in chapter 5, why he favors and is more connected to the youth. Holden introduces his young brother, Allie. Allie died very young, from leukemia. When he died Holden took it very hard; destroying windows in the garage. Ever since then, he has favored the youth more then adulthood. His relationship with Allie was like what most sibling relationship should be. They loved each other and were very close. You can tell that he really misses his brother by the way he talks about him. Holden has nothing but positive things to say about Allie. Now, when he sees other children, he cant help but have Allie in the back of his mind. He appreciates his brother so he appreciates and cares for every child he sees. Holden also says that Allie had red hair and a red cap. The color red symbolizes youth. Sometimes when Holden is feeling depress he wears that cap. Maybe its to feel as young as Allie, but it can also be that he feels Allies presents their. We might think he’s just crazy, but the strength of the relationship between Allie and Holden might be stronger then we know.
Another thing I found interesting was that there are many things that symbolize something throughout the Catcher in the Rye. Theirs red, which symbolizes youth, and there is also the color yellow. Holden refers yellow to weakness and cowardliness. He knows he is yellow, but by discussing various degrees of being yellow, he’s sugar coating it to make it seem not as bad when he says he’s yellow. He doesn’t want to be someone who is weak. In his mind, for a child to be scared or defenseless, its okay, because they are only a kid and its natural for someone like an adult, to defend for them. But, since he knows, deep down inside, that he’s going to be an adult one day, he needs to know how to defend himself, to not be yellow. By him constantly talking about it, he has a way of comparing himself to be yellow but also showing he’s not that yellow. He’ll say that he’s yellow but he’ll show us images in his mind of him not being yellow. Its just his way to show that he isn’t weak; he is not yellow, even though he admits that he is.
I also thought it is a very important part of the book when Holden tells his little sister, Phoebe, that he wishes he can be a catcher in the rye. He imagines children in a rye field and him having the need to catch them before they fall off the cliff. The significance of him wanting to be the catch in the rye is the explanation to why Holden acts how he does. His image of kids being innocent and not phony is only because that’s how he saw his little brother Allie; that’s what he thinks he knows. But, for him to be an adult, he knows nothing. He doesn’t know what to do or where to go as an adult. Since he knows nothing then in his mind he’s probably thinking that children are even more clueless about it. If he doesn’t catch the children falling of the rye field cliff, then something bad might happen to them, or they might end up alone like him. He doesn’t want any child to be alone like he is because they might end up depressed as well. Holden just wants to save the children from the unknown.
My name is Karla Alanis i was wondering; why is it that teenagers don’t know what they want? At moments they want to be treated like adults. For example there is a party and they want to get home later than curfew; they will come up with a reason they will think is possible to get them that yes, but if they get a no their next excuse will be “I want to be treated like an adult.” When it comes to paying rent, bills, giving money for groceries, buying their own clothes, ext. is when teenagers are glad their children and not adults. Honestly I think that is the most common excuse a teenager will use to try and get what they want. It can be a dumb excuse because being an adult will mean you need no permission from your parents and you can do as you please. Being treated like an adult as a teenager figure out how hard an independent life can be.
ReplyDeleteHolden got all dressed and went down to the lobby from his hotel. He heard the band playing in the Lavender Room and he went in there. They seated him on a lousy table on the back next to three women he described as old, showoff, looking, pretty ugly. They had on the kind of the hats that right away Holden knew they were out of town. He was eyeing them and gave more attention to the blond one. The reason for his contact with these ladies was because Holden likes to dance and he obviously needed a partner to do so with. The three ladies were giggling at the remarks he made; for example when he asked them to dance, they could not believe it and giggled. The blond one stood up and dances with him because she can tell he was mostly talking to her.
Holden thinks adults are a bunch of phonies, which is his favorite word throughout the book. He knows children are not in that stage and are more truthful than adults. I think he enjoys reading a child’s school notebook because they can be interesting. Children seem to pay attention to details in life that adults let pass by. Children will not lie to themselves only because they want to feel good or happy. Children are not phony! Holden would rather read child’s school notebook than a old women’s diary. All do to the different point of view they would have under the same situation.
Hey Mr. H its Lauren Miranda. There were three things i thought was interesting in the book Catcher in the rye. First thing is in the book Holden says "I thought about giving old Jane a buzz, to see if she was home yet and all, but i wasn't in the mood". Through out this whole book Holden complains about not being in the mood to call up Jane. Instead Holden calls up old Sally Hayes to see if they could meet up. Holden hasn't heard from or talked to Jane since she was still a child. Holden doesn't really want to call her because he is affraid that she has lost her innocence and grew up to become a phoney. With Sally, Holden already know's and think's she's a phoney. So Holden wont be disappointed when he goes out with Sally. Holden is just really lonely right now so he doesn't mind meeting up with Sally Hayes even though he thinks she's phoney.
ReplyDeleteSecondly Holden tells Mrs. Morrow that his name was "Rudolf Schmidt". In the book Holden say's that he didnt feel like giving her his whole life story. Holden probably didnt want to have to explain why he was leaving pencey, since he had been exspelled. Since he was probably never going to see her againhe thought it would be easier to just shoot the bull. After a while Holden realizes that he sorta liked Mrs. Morrow and whished he would have told her his real name. In a way Holden seems lazy becouse he say's it would take to long to actually tell the truth. With this part in the book who even knows if he is telling the whole truth. Holden could just be shooting the bull.
Lastly Holden seems to really enjoy childhood. He seem's to love everything about it. When Holden reads his sister Phoebe notebook he doesn't see anything phoney about it. With childrens notebook's they make you laugh because they express how they feel. Through out this whole book Holden talks about how real children are and how they are still innocent. I Think that Holden feels there are no lies when he reads a childs school notebook. Children make him laugh and feel young again. He doesn't feel like the children are phonies and he appreciate that.
Hello Mr.H this is Ruben Cortez its very interesting that you ask about Catcher in The Rye because i found it to be very interesting also. One of the things that i found interesting in Holden never seems to be in the mood to call Jane, he never seems to be in the mood to do many things. I think that the reason that he refuses to say hi to her when he has the chance or to even call her up is because he fears her being phony. He remembers her as innocent and not phony whatsoever so he doesnt want to ruin the mental picture he has of her. He lives in a world that he sees as changing and very phony and she is one of the people that he knows that isnt phony in his opinion. By phony he really means young and innocent which he wants her to always be. He wants to stay young and wants Jane to stay with him.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing that i found interesting was that the relationship that Mr. Spencer and Holden share. I think its not so much as a professional teacher to student relationship but a more caring one. He has more feelings for Holden. I think Mr. Spencer fears for holden's well being and wants him to do okay. I think that Mr. Spencer knows that holden is suffering from a mental illness. Mr. Spencer tries to talk to holden the last time he sees him about how life has to be followed according to rules. Mr.Spencer cares for Holden not just as a teacher but as a friend.
The last thing i found mainly interesting about the story is how Holden wants to be the Catcher in the Rye. He wants to keep the kids from falling off the cliff of adulthood. He also wishes that he knew the next phase that he has to go to. Something that is related to his ambition of being catcher in the rye is the question he asks about the ducks in the pond and where do they go during winter. He wants to be catcher in the rye to keep kids from going up and becoming adults because in Holden's view all adults are phony. He wants to keep his little sister from becoming phony as well as himself. Holden is lost and has no idea of what he has to do next he doesn't want to move into the next step of adulthood.
Hey Mr. Hatrshorn, it's Hanalei here. It's funny you mention Catcher in the Rye. I actually found a few details that were interesting to me. I also noticed that Holden Caulfield is quite the character.
ReplyDeleteAs I was reading, something Holden said caught my eye. Holden mentions a thing or two about books. He says that a book is good if you wish the author were a personal friend of yours. Personally,
had I the opportunity to befriend any one of the authors' whose book I've read, I would just love to be friends with Lilith Saintcrow. She had a wild imagination, and her books rock! If we were close friends, I know we would be talking about books, reviewing other works from different authors, and giving each other advice for our own work. Of course I would ask her about what motivated her to write some of her stories. I would want to know where she got her ideas.
Also, Holden mentions a girl named Jane Gallagher quite often throughout the book. One thing that caught my eye the most is the relationship this Jane character had with her step father. In the book, Holden recalls a scene with Jane at her house. The two were playing checkers together. The man comes up to Jane and asks her if she knew where the cigarettes were. After he had gone into the house, Jane began to cry. Now, the book doesn't necessarily explain their relationship, it's really left up to the reader to assume the rest. I honestly think that step father has made a move on Jane or has sexually harassed the young girl. Holden himself mentions what he thinks was going on. I agree with him only because situations like this one is commonly known to happen. The step father must have done something horrible to Jane to make her cry.
The most interesting thing I saw while reading was in regards to Wilhelm Stekel's quote. Stkel says," THe mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of the mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one." I beliveve that dying got a cause, no matter how great, is immature. Dying won't help the cause, it only weakens it. Wars are fought with large numbers. If your army of two thousand men is going up against one made up of ten million men, the chances of you winning that battle are slim to none. The idea applies for any cause. To obtain power, you need numbers. THe numbers you auire can provide you with a large amount of things. FOr example, they could provide the following: weapons, food and water, supplies, and even shelter.
If you die, who will fight in your place? No one. Once people see their numbers dwindling, they lose fight and passion. Instead, that passion and fight is replaced with fear and doubt
Those who are overcome with fear are more submissive than those with purpose. If a cause is succeed, the people fighting must come together as a strong unit. Only then will you see the end. Dying may seem noble, but to die is to take the easy option out of struggle. The true challenge lies in the fighting, the organizing, and the life of a cause.
Also, there is always room for different kinds of people, be they mature or not. No matter how many fights we go through, r how many times we state our opinions, there will always be opposition. How you react to the opposition and the consequences of your actions affects how effective you really are.
Well, there you are Mister Hartshorn. Those are the main three details I took note of while reading The Catcher in the Rye. To be honest, the reading was not an enjoyable one, but it did teach me something new. It help open my eyes, I guess you could say. Have a great summer!
Goodmorning Mr.Hartshorn how are you doing in this wonderful morning ? This is Johana Camacho and I happen to find three interesting things about Holden. For starters in chapter five it talks about how Holden's brother Allie died. But before he died his relationship with him was surprisingly good. I particularly believe it was good because Allie was such a nice guy. He would never get mad at anyone, infact he would always laugh. He enjoyed laughing. Unfortunately Holden misses him a lot. Holden says that one summer he had a gut feeling that if he would turn around he would see him. Indeed he did. He saw Allie sitting on his bike outside the fence. When he found out that Allie was dead he started to break the windows from the garage, and even broke his hand. He truely misses his brother Allie. Another person he was close to was Jane. Their relatioship was good since one summer Jane was his neighbor. They use to play checkeers together. He even knows her techniques.
ReplyDeleteAnother interesting fact about Holden is that he feels lonely. In chapter twelve he startes feelling lonely because he's in a big city which is New York. Since Holden doesn't know anyone he feels lonely in that big city. Also since he wasn't to familiar with New York he got a cab. While the cab driver Horwitz was driving Holden and him were having a conversation. The conversation was about fishes and where they go when the lake gets frozen. So Harwitz explained to Holden that the fishes stay in the lake and people skate in the lake since it's frozen. Then Holden asked the cab driver Horwitz if he wanted to go with him to Ernie's and have a drink with him. Unfortunately he said no beacause he said he didn't have time for alcohol. While he was at Ernie's he saw Lillian Simmons. She was a girl that his brother D.B. use to go around with.
Lastly towards the end of chapter twenty-three Holden didn't care if his parent's found him home or not. At first he was trying to get out while his parents were busy. Like when his mom was in the restroom and his dad was watching t.v. But towards the end he didn't care anymore beacause in a way he wanted his parents to catch him leaving the house because deep down he wanted to stay home. He even started to cry and Phoebe was comforting him. When he left instead of talking the elevator he took the stairs. Which im thinking he did that so their could be foot steps noise, and so his parents could go check who was walking down the stairs.
Hi Mr. Hartshorn this is Antrone Saddler and this book kept me quite intrigued. There are alot of things that i found interesting about this book and three really stood out. On would be about Holden lying for hours, it means that he could be making this whole entire story up. I believe this theory because he is a phony anyways. I believe that he lies about others to make himself seem more innocent. Ive also noticed that he lies to gain something from it. Like, the talk he had with Mrs. Morrow. He thought she looked really good with a alot if sex appeal. So I think he just said that to get on her good side and telling her stuff about her sin that any mother would want to hear. I personally think ge us lying because he usually dosent say nice things about others especially to phonies. I dont think Holden is one that can be trusted in this book. He is like the king of sarcasm.
ReplyDeleteSecondly, i found it funny that Holden makes excuses and stuff abiout him still being a virgin. Since he is a terrific liar, its quite possible for him to lie even about this. He is barely able to make a friend so I dont know how he can get a girl to have sex with him. He claims that he was going to do it but girls tell him to stop. I think he tries to force himself close to them and then they tell him to stop. I believe Holden cant really get that far with a girl. Also, as for the excuses like the parents come home at the wrong time, its so obvious that it happens often but still people end up doing it. Holden is a phony and he cant even get the confidence to call Jane, so having sex is out if of the question.
Lastly, Holden wants ti become the Catcher in the Rye because he just doesn't like phonies. Especially if its a family member like Phoebe. He can easily tell that she is growing up and she soon will become a phony. He wants to catch the little kids that don't know where they are going and just save him. I believe he just doesn't want another kid with his mentality. he wants kids to stay innocent for as long as they can. He knows that they cant stay little forever and they will soon go to adulthood. I think keeping them reminds of how Allie and him once were.
Hey Mister Hartshorn. This is Carolina Marroquin. I really found this book very weird. I have never really read a book that doesnt really have a meaning to it and if it did i guess i didnt understand it well. Throughout the book there were a few things that i thought that should be talked about because they were interesting topics.
ReplyDeleteFirst off i wanted to discuss Holdens liking about reading childrens notebooks. From what i understood i think he enjoys it is because, like he has always said kids are the only people you are phony in his eyes. Reading the way their innocent minds thinks probably makes him feel better about the bad way the world works. He even says in Ch 21. "I can read that kind of stuff, some kids notebook...all day and all night long. Kids notebooks kill me" Holden believes that everyone around is a phony at life and always trying to be something they arent or fake to people. Children still have the sense in their mind that anything is possible and the world is a good place. So maybe its possible that Holdens love for children and how they think keeps him somewhat sane.
Another thing i wanted to bring up is Holdens enjoyment when talking to the nuns. I found that very interesting because Holden doesnt say something bad about them, he actually says they were nice people. I think he liked them because they werent acting phony and Holden was able to actually hold a good conversation with them. One reason that he liked talking to them was because they didnt spoil the conversation by trying to find out if he was catholic. That had happened once before to him and he said "that kind of stuff drives me crazy" & "im not saying it ruined the conversation ... but it sure as hell didnt do it any good." So since his last experience was a bad one with nuns he was happy that this time around it was a good one.
Hey Hartshorn its Alicia Villicana and i would like to talk about what ive read in this book The Catch In The Rye.
ReplyDeleteHe says if he had to be anything, it would be the person in the poem “the catch in the rye” by Robert burns. Holden see’s the poem as a symbol of heroism, that the kids all over the world were playing in a field of rye right over a cliff, while he would be the “catcher” and make sure none of the kids would fall over. He wants to be the person that helps the kids fall into the cruel reality of that society has to offer. But to him he’s the only exception that can be “big” in the field of rye. Holden thinks he’s able to stay young and innocent until he decides that he’s ready to grow up and take the responsibilities that come with it. I also think its funny that he thinks he’s the best to even take that role, how he doesn’t see anyone else that would be better suited for that certain type of job. He wants to stay innocent and naive yet want to take the responsibility of watching over so many other kids innocence.
I think Holden definitely has issues with himself because he has such a fear of “phonies”. To me I believe the word “phony” to Holden means someone who has accepted the harsh truth of reality and most of those things is irrelevant to Holden. Everyone that’s an adult is a phony to Holden, except children. I’m pretty sure Holden likes pointing out the phonies he notices because he wants to be able to analyze the “phony” characteristics they have to reassure himself that they really are phonies in his eye. He may not realize that what he see’s as phony is really how people are and Holden doesn’t want to except that that’s how people are turning. He is the type of person that rejects people that don’t believe in the same things as he does, but he’s too scared to let them know he thinks that about them. Even though he’s a pretty straight up guy and calls it like he see’s it, he’s still a scared little boy that’s too scared to take things one on one.
Holden is concerned about the ducks at central park during the winter because the lagoon at the park freezes over, so where do the ducks go after is Holden’s question. Through out the book he asks random people about the welfare of the ducks, like where they go when the pond freezes over, or when they do go why that place? All these questions that Holden wants answers to are symbols that represent his life in the world. Holden is the ducks that need to move when winter comes. It’s the change of environment, people and atmosphere. Holden has shown clear signs of him no being able to adapt to most of his environments through out this book. An example would be his short stay at Pencey, he didn’t really know how to talk to the other students and staff. When he even has a prostitute in his room he doesn’t even now how to act with her when he paid to do something with her and couldn’t do that with her. He doesn’t want to grow up, even though a lot of people might be just like Holden and don’t want to accept that they don’t want to grow up or just cant. Holden is scared and terrified of growing up, he runs away from any obstacle that might give him the slightest opportunity at gaining responsibility.
Hey Mr.Hartshorn,its Ivonne Chavez as I was looking through some information about the book The Catcher In the Rye i had come across your blog.I read some interesting things and i would like to share three things about the book that i found interesting. First of all when Holden wanted to make contact with three unsophisticated women i thought he did that because he couldnt get a good looking women to talk to him because he starts saying to himself that they are phony.Another possiblity that he had done this was because he coulnt get his mind off Jane and what better way to try to flirt with some lower class girls.He wanted to convince himslef that somebody else does care about him and that hes not alone(page91¨I really felt like dancing¨).He knew that based on how they looked(unattractive) that he had a better chance in being with them than a prettier women.It took him a while to realize that they were just a bunch of loosers based on what they had on ¨At the table to the right next to me, there were three girls around 30, the whole three of them were pretty ugly and had on the kind of hats you knew they werent from New York¨.The second thing that had me very interesting was that in the end of the book he says to never tell anybody anything because you start missing them, i think what he meant was you come in a point in your life when you are fed up and full with rage that you tell someone how you feel and other things that are possibly are not true you hurt them and kick them out of your life you soon realize you had done something wrong but you dont fix it because of your pride.Then comes a point when you need someone there for you but the thing is theres nobody there anymore.Once you start critisizing a person you start doing the same habits that you used to think it was annoying when they did it.This starts happening because you want to feel comfort because you know that you had lost someone that had really cared about you.Everybody needs somebody to be there for them and Holden didnt notice that until he had lost everything.As he realizes he had made a mistake he notices he cant do nothing about it, and maybe he would learn.The good side about this is that hes starting to mature and realizing that he couldve treat them better.Holden knows that holding on to kids from growing up had to stop because thats the only way they will learn.Therfore he realizes the only phony was HIM.The last interesting thing i had found is that major obession of Holden is created so he can critisize others and not think about how much of a phony he is.He can critisize anyone, just on how they look or act he doesnt care he just wnats to find their faults.He thinks as himself as perfect so finds others flaws to make himself feel better.Obession with phonies is what he cares about the most and that what is revolved around him.When he seees others suceed such as his brother D.B. he automatically considers them as phonies just because they have done something with their lives. According to Holden if you are maturing or already a grown up you are a phony because you cant keep your word and dont do what you are suppose to.So this obession is going to take over him to protect him from knowing he will let go eventually of his childhood to become an adult. So there you have it these interesting things have caught my eye and i hope you agree.
ReplyDeleteHey Mr. Hartshorn this is jennifer Ibarra i had a great time reading the catcher in the rye. i actually learned a couple of things from it believe it or not. Here are some of my opinions.
ReplyDeleteTeenagers wanting to be treated like adults but at the same time wanting to be treated like little kids.Many teenagers wish they were adults already.So they can drive off whenever the wanted to or whenever they felt like it.Some of them just wishing that they were old enough so they could go partying. Its mostly the feelimg about about being able to be more independent rather then having to depend on their parents or ask for permisson. Being treated as an adult is alot more then what it really seems to be. Adult life is more like findin a job, moving out,paying bills on their own, cooking and cleaning.Yet, some people don't realize that they have that done for them at home.Which brings us back to holden tyring to drink all night but he could not because of his age. He was at the bar that night and they kept refusing to give him an alcoholic beverage. Yet, wanting to still be a small little kid is what many teenagers also wish for sometimes. Being able to get most of the toys they wanted, watching their favorite cartoons, playing games. M<ost importantly still being able so innocent and speaking out everything they had in their minds without anyone telling them something or judging their sincere opinion. For example holden says everyone is "phony" or believes that everyone is PHONY according to him its because they are adults. throughout the book he calls many people phony like old Mr. Haas when he smiles at the parents in the moring and goes up to their car when they arrive.Then again he does not realize that he himself is a big time phony frome the start to the end of the book. Like when he says he hates movies but yet he agrees to go with Brossard and Ackley to the movies. Holden can't get the fact in his headd that he himself is becoming an adlut. When Holden talks aboput how the museum stays the same throught the years and it doesn't change at all. He says you can go back to the museum ears laster and the man cathching the fish would still be in the same position they were years back. All Holden tries to do is hold on to his childhood. Holden is afraid of becoming a phony adult like everyone else so he thinks.
In the book Holden tries to call Jane Gallagher but every time the subject comes up he makes up an excuse.Everytime he talks himself out of calling and talking to. When Stradlater was gooing to go on a date with Jane Gallagher Holden kept mentioning going to sai "hi" to her but again he starts with his excuses of "not being in the mood and having to be in the mood for things like that." The only reason forthe excuses was that Holden was scared to find out whether Jane grew up to be a Phony just like all the other adults according to Holden.He just really didn't want to find out.
At the end of his story Holden mentions that he misses everbody in his story but to not tell anyone because pretty much he himself is being a phony. After judging them and all and calling some of them he misses them. He doesn't realize it but hes a phony.
Hey Mr.Hartshorn How's it going? Its Sayuri Diaz Well there was 3 topics that got my attention the most these topics are. . . .
ReplyDeleteFirst thing I would like to talk about is the reason he didn’t talk to Jane Gallagher because of what had happened in ch.4 when Stradlater went out with Jane. Holden thinks that Stradlater gave her a good time in Ed Banky’s car and he thinks that she’s not the same anymore so what happens now is that when he thinks about calling her he’s about to but when he reaches the phone he’s afraid to call. Ends up not being in the mood. He can’t seem to see that people change when they start to grow up which is something he hasn’t done at all. He keeps her in his mind but when he’s out drinking or sees a couple or something all of a sudden he reminds himself of Stradlater and Jane together. Holden thinks that she’s the same Jane that lost golf balls and lived next door to him with a dog who used to do his business next door.
Another part of the story that I would like to discuss is Holden being the “Catcher in the Rye”. Holden is trying to keep the innocence of little kids and he’s trying to keep the children from becoming impure and wild. Holden is grieving the death of Allie so that made me wonder if his grieving over Allie made him lose his mind. Holden is at a “No” state of mind meaning he’s like no I don’t want to grow up I don’t want to be a grown up I want to keep my innocence I don’t want to become an adult. He’s so stuck on what he wants that he doesn’t see; that he can’t get it through his mind that kids eventually have to grow up and live their life the way they want not the way people want them to stay. We were scientifically created with a mind that we eventually use by the time we are 4 years old because we start to process things in our mind and start to think stuff that we never thought of thinking before.
Holden’s obsession with phonies is really funny somewhat hysterical but most off all its annoying. He thinks everyone is fake; For example he thinks a teacher like Mr. Hass says hi to parents is a phony and acting nice because he’s a teacher and that would be the right thing to do when you speak to a student’s parents. He thinks people who are kind of friendly, like Stradlater, are phonies. He basically thinks anyone who is kind nice does something good is a good person good reputation is phony cause they‘re just acting because in the world that Holden lives in everyone is acting. He thinks someone who acts like they like everything is phony.
Hey! My name is Mitchell Allbee, and I wanted to let you know what I thought about The Catcher in the Rye. I enjoyed the book because I feel like it related to me in a way. Sometimes I want to go back in time to my childhood, because life was a lot easier back then. However, I do realize that everyone must grow up. It is good to reminisce about good old times, but it is bad to stay stuck in the past. As I read about Holden’s journey, there were a few key points that stood out to me.
ReplyDeleteOne thing that caught my eye in the story was that Holden had a great relationship with his brother, Allie, and an interesting one with Jane Gallagher. Allie had died of leukemia while they were in Maine in 1946. Holden was always reminded of his brother almost every day, meaning he reminisced about their time together before he passed away. Holden loved his brother so much that he chose to write Stradlater’s composition about Allie’s left-handed fielder’s mitt. Holden could even imagine Allie watching him play golf. He had nothing but positive things to say about his brother, and he truly missed him. On the other hand, Jane Gallagher was another person in Holden’s life. My perception of their relationship is that they used to be good friends until recently. Holden almost never had the nerve to simply call her because he was afraid that she too had become a phony, but he thought about her all the time. Allie and Jane were two characters in the book that Holden could not avoid remembering.
Another point that stood out to me was that Holden changed his mind about going into the museum. It was because he, himself, had changed. He stated that nothing in the museum ever changed and remained the same over the years. Holden was the type of person who despised change because he wanted everything and everyone to stay the same. Holden knew that everything inside the museum had stayed the same since he was at Pencey until the present time when he stood before the building. The only problem stopping him from entering the museum was the fact that he knew people viewing the different galleries had changed every single time they visited. He refused going into the museum because he had also changed. That is why Holden changed his mind about entering the museum. His date with Sally had nothing to do with altering his decision. He just wanted everything to stay the same.
The last thing that stood out to me was that Holden wanted to be the “catcher in the rye.” Holden described how he hated phonies, and he believed that once someone turned into an adult, they become a phony. He wished that everybody would remain a child in order to maintain innocence. He described childhood as a rye field where all the young children would be running around. Falling off the edge of the cliff represented the change from childhood to adulthood. He wanted to be the “catcher in the rye” in order to prevent kids from growing up. Since he wanted to avoid adulthood for everyone, he wanted to catch kids from falling off the field of innocence. Later on, Holden realized he could not be the catcher in the rye, because at some point, everyone must grow up.
Thanks for reading my comments about The Catcher in the Rye. I enjoyed reading about Holden’s journey! I hope that my thoughts about the book were interesting to read. Bye!
Hi, my name is Emily Franco and there were three things I found interesting about The Catcher in the Rye.The first thing I thought was interesting was when Holden said he wished his favorite authors were his friend, so he could call them. Like Holden, I also would like to meet the authors of some of the books i have read. One of the books that I would really like to meet is Julie Garwood. I would ask her if she models her characters after anyone in particular because they seem like they’ve been taken out of a contemporary novel and put into a historical. Her female characters in particular are very interesting. They are brave, strong-willed women, but that isn’t why they are interesting. They also say things that are so ridiculous you have to laugh, like when her character in Castles, Princess Alesandra, made a list of questions to ask and put “Can pregnant wives be nuns?”. Another author I wish I was friends with is Stephanie Meyer. Though she is most well known for the Twilight series, my favorite book that she wrote is the Host. I would ask her if she would support or be against an alien invasion as the one in her book. Though the aliens in her book are benevolent, to survive they must take over the humans’ body. Though it is rare, the host’s and the alien’s conscious are both present in the main character’s body.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing that I thought was interesting was that Holden never calls Jane even though he talks about it.I think that Holden didn’t call Jane Gallagher, because he didn’t want to know her if she wasn’t like she was as a child. He comes up with a plan to call her so she wouldn’t get in trouble for him calling her. Also during this time, he was talking about sex, and how he always sets up rules for himself and how he was horny. I believe that he didn’t want to associate her or his memory of her with these thoughts because they are considered to be adult. These thoughts would also lead him to remember that she and Stradlater were in the back of Ed Banky’s car and he doesn’t want to think of her as a woman who goes on dates. He wants to keep her as an innocent child in his memories that never did anything adult-like. She is a subconscious symbol for Holden’s childhood and he doesn’t want his childhood corrupted.
Another thing that I liked about this book was the character, Luce. He’s very open about his ideas and seems very intelligent. Even Holden said that he had a great vocabulary. Most girls wouldn’t appreciate that he talks about sex so much, especially in that era, but it is something that guys do no matter their maturity level. In a way he is similar to Mr. Antolini in the fact that he knows Holden better than Holden knows himself. Luce tells Holden to grow up and also told him to get psychoanalyzed. He also said to Holden, “Naturally, your mind is immature. I commend Luce for his patience when Holden says, “What are you majoring in? Perverts?” Then Holden said that Luce doesn’t want to be serious. I like that Luce likes Eastern philosophy because there are a lot of interesting theories that originate from Asia, such as reincarnation and karma. Also I like that he is dating a Chinese girl because during this time most people were discriminate on who they were supposed to date.
Thank you for reading the things that I thought were interesting.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn! Its Timothy Corral. Throughout the whole book I wanted to kill Holden because of how crazy he was, however, after reading through the book, I can actually relate to a lot of the things he was talking about! These are some of the questions that I pondered upon.
ReplyDeleteQ: Why do you think Holden is concerned about the welfare of the ducks in Central Park during winter?
A: Holden Caulfield is capricious, however, he does not realize it. Holden is wandering where the ducks go when their habitat becomes inhabitable. He wonders where they go then their life gets hard. I believe Holden asks this specific question for two reasons. The first reason is, if the ducks know what to do and know where to go when life gets hard for them, then Holden should know also. The second reason is I believe Holden asks this is because he is trying to find resolve. In the beginning of the chapter, Holden says “ My brother DB is in Hollywood . My kid sister Phoebe goes to bed at around nine o’clock so i couldn’t wake her up.” What can we imply from all these statements? Holden is alone. His life, metaphorically speaking, has been frozen. Holden is just trying to know how to adapt to his situation.
Q: Discuss Holdens obsession with “Phonies”
A: Holden is definitely an interesting study. He believes that only young children are “real”, or truthfully honest. He also thinks that everyone is a phony. I think Holden is obsessed with phonies because they are someone more successful than him. I’m not saying that Holden is jealous, but more like Holden is just trying to say things are unfair. Holden is always contemplating about someone. While people octrize Holden out loud, he octrazizes them in his head. Now that I look back at the book, Holden is just trying to claim justice against all the liars out there. In turn however, Holden becomes so obsessed with phonies that he does not realize that he became one himself.
Q: At the end of chapter 23, why is that Holden no longer cares if his parents find him at home?
A: I can only think of two reasons why Holden would stop caring if his parents caught him or not. For one thing, he could be so happy after seeing his little sister, that he feels as if nothing can depress him any more. Ther other reason could be that holden actually wants to go back home. Maybe he actually misses having a family that loves and cares for him. I know i have felt like that before. Sometimes I get so happy that I don’t even care what happens to next. Holden most likely just wants to go back home Holden knows his situation may turn around if his parents caught him. Holden says, “Then I told her again, I’d give her a buzz when I have a chance...” If he gets caught right then and there, then he won’t need to go through all the trouble to call anyone.
You're right Mr. Hartshorn it was a pretty awesome book to read even though there were lots of people who were phonies. This is Jorge Ayala and I do have some things to share about this book with you. First of all let me start by saying that Holden was a very cowardly guy when it came to having a conversation with Jane Gallagher. In chapter four when he's with Stradlater he finds out that Jane is Stradlater's date for that particular night. Even though he knew that Jane was at his place Holden didn’t have the guts to go up and talk to her. All he did was tell Stradlater how he himself should go and say hello to Jane but he never does. He also tells the reader that he wasn’t in the mood to go and say hi. Obviously what he said was a lie. The main reason why Holden doesn’t want to make contact with Jane is that he's too afraid of going up to her and because he has feelings for her. Holden in this chapter really shows the reader his true feeling about Jane which is amour.
ReplyDeleteHolden didn’t only seem to like her but for him Jane was special. The way Holden described their relationship it seemed like they were really close friends. Holden remembered how Jane used to do ballet two hours every day, no matter the weather conditions; he remembered how they used to play checkers and how she would never move her kings from the back row. From all this I can infer that Holden really liked her and was excited because maybe they can be close friends again. I also think that Holden had a very close relationship with his brother Allie, even though Allie was two years younger Holden said that he was the smartest one in the family, that he was so nice to everyone, and that he never got mad at anyone. When Holden lost his little brother it really had a big impact on him. Holden was very upset and broken. He even takes Allie's old baseball glove with him to Pency, I guess as a reminder of Allie.
Even though Holden lost his little brother he still had Phoebe with him. Phoebe was his little sister and was someone special to him as well as Jane and Allie. One thing that I found interesting was how one day Holden found Phoebe’s notebook and started reading it. In the book he said that he enjoys reading children’s school notebook because the kids are sincere and are no phonies. The children for Holden are people that are not embarrass to say what they are thinking not like adults who are. So one of the main reasons why Holden enjoys reading the children’s notebooks is because they keep him away from phoniness. This book thought me a lot of things one was to not be a phony and it sure was a book worth reading. These are my thoughts about The Catcher in the Rye and hopefully they are some things that not I only saw but that were also view by others.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn, How's it going? I was going through your blog and wanted to discuss three things.
ReplyDeletefirst of all, Dr. Thurmer has a concept of life, that it is a long game. To play this game you should play it by the rules and only by the rules. I agree with his concept on life because to evenget to the top, you would have to play by the rules. Afterwards, once you have reached the climax, then and only then you could not start to play by the rules. On the other hand, Holden would definitly disagree with my opinion. This is so because Ho0lden states "Game, my ass. Some game." Meaning his thoughts that he doesn't think it really is a fair game. Also, he doesn't think it's a fair game because he states "If you ge ton the side where all the hot-shots are, then it's a game, all right. But if you get on the other side, where there aren't any hot-shots, then what's a game about it?" This quote meaning if you play with the hot-shots, then it's going to be a game, but if not, then theres no game at all.
Second, I would like to discuss when Holden states that he can "go on lying for hours" if he "feels like it." It just effects the reader by putting mistrusts in Holden to see if he really is telling the truth in the whole book. On the other hand, it does say when he feels like it. Also, it just gives the reader more of a reason to believe that Holden is a phony, and he placces himself with other "phonies." But then again, we can't tell whether he is stating the truth when he tells about events of characters placing them int o the phonie category. Hence, we could state that Holden is crazy.
Lastly, I would like to describe Holden's obsession with phoniness. I can start by saying he loves to surround himself with phonies. Or on the other hand he thinks everyone is a phony if he doesn't like what they do, even if it's only one thing he doesn't like about them. Holden thinks that everyone is wrong and a phony. He even admits that he is one at times, but he still doesn't consider himself a bigger phony then anyone else. He mostly considers adults the phony's but never the children. Just like the event in the book when someone wrote on the wall "fuck you" at Phoebe's school. He was so wquick to judge that it was an adult that wrote it and not just a student.
Ronnie Cadiente
DeleteHey Mr.Hartshorn! It’s Mariam Shawki from third period. The three things I found interesting about the book “The Catcher in the Rye” is first, Holden’s obsession with phonies. In chapter one, the readers start to learn about who Holden Caulfield is and why he got stuck in a mental hospital. The main reason why he got sick is because of all the phonies he knew. The first example of why Holden didn’t give Pencey prep, his fourth school a chance is because the school was too phony and even the people in it. He describes the school phony in chapter one, by their advertisement. Although he never says their advertisement is phony, he explains it. He says when you first see their advertisement in magazines; they always have some hot shot guy on a horse jumping over a fence. Like if all they ever did at Pencey was play polo, but Holden never has once seen a horse anywhere near the place or even anyone play polo. Also their quote underneath the picture is phony; it always says” since 1888 we have been molding boys into splendid, clear- thinking young men.” But Holden says that he has never seen anyone he has met that’s splendid or even clear thinking. Another example that shows Holden’s obsession with phonies is why he liked the headmaster’s daughter, Selma Thurmer. He liked her because whenever you talked to her, she never gave you any bull about what a great of a guy her father was. That she probably knew what a phony slob he was. This shows you that Holden doesn’t like anyone at that school, unless they’re not phonies.
ReplyDeletestill continued......
The second thing I found interesting is Holden’s relationship with Jane Gallagher. In chapter eleven, Holden describes the way he met Jane and why he is so concerned about her. The first time Holden has met Jane was at the club he used to go to. He saw her lying down near the pool on her stomach. He then went up to her and said hello, and at first Jane was startled because his mother had complained to Jane’s mother a couple of days before, because of her dog relieving himself on their lawn. Holden told her that he didn’t care and tried to convince her how much he didn’t. Then after he finally persuaded her, they became friends and started to hang out. When they started to hang out, Holden’s mother never liked Jane and even thought she wasn’t good looking. But Holden says that “I did, though. I just liked the way she looked, that’s all.” From this part and the way Holden feels about Jane’s look, I began to understand why Jane was so important to Holden and why he fought Stradlater. Another example that describes Holden’s relationship with Jane is when they came close to necking. Holden says it was a Saturday and it was raining really hard outside, and he was over at her house that day playing checkers on her porch. He remembers that he was kidding around with her about keeping her kings in the back row and not using them. But he never kidded with Jane too much, because he likes it best when you can kid the pants off a girl when the opportunity arises. Also because the girl he likes a lot is never the one he likes kidding. So as they were playing checkers her “booze hound” step dad came out, asking her for where the cigarettes were but she never answer’s him. Then he asked again, and when she still didn’t answer him, he went back inside the house. Holden then asked her what was going on and she didn’t answer him either. She just still sat there, acting like she was focused on the game. Then all of the sudden, she began to tear. Then Holden went over on her side and sat next to her. Then that’s when she began to cry more. So all of the sudden, Holden began to kiss her all over. He kissed her on the eyes, nose, forehead, eyebrows, ears, and her whole face. Except her mouth because she sort of wouldn’t let him, and that was the closest he ever got to necking with her. From this example you learn that Holden respected Jane, that he didn’t want to kid around with her and rowan their friendship. Also that Holden liked Jane a lot, but he never wanted to admit it to the readers. That’s why he kissed her all over and was concerned about her when she cried. So Holden and Jane’s relationship could be described as just friendship, they were really close best friends. But to Holden it was more like if they were lovers.
ReplyDeletestill continued,by mariam shawki............
The third thing I found interesting is in chapter eighteen, when Holden says that he is glad the atomic bomb has been invented. What he means by that is he is glad that there is a weapon that could be used to destroy and kill people. The reason he says that is because he is tired and angry from everyone around him he knows, they all became too phony for him and he can’t stand them anymore. Just like the reason why he wears the hunting hat. He thinks “it’s a people shooting hat”, he imagines shooting people with the hat. All the phony ones, he can’t stand. So he also imagines the atomic bomb as a weapon, that’s being dropped and destroying and killing all the phony people and places. That’s why he swears, that it’s the reason why he would volunteer, if there was another war. He wants to be able to be the person, who does much for mankind, destroying every phony thing on earth. Although he says before, that it would drive him crazy, if he had to be in the army with bunch of guys like Ackley and Stradlter, marching behind them and all. That if there is ever another war, they better just take him out and stick him in front of the firing squad. Just so he could die and be a happy man, who doesn’t get stuck with phony bastards for the rest of his life. But when it comes to another war, where the U.S has to use the atomic bomb. He would love to volunteer for the war because he wants to be able to be one of the soldier’s in the army, who got to use the bomb to kill all the phony people and destroy all the phony places that ever made him angry and annoyed.
ReplyDeleteSorry i had to post the three comments three times because it wouldn't let me post all the paragraphs.Well, thank you for reading my comments and hope you have a great day, bye! =)
Dear Mr. Hartsorn i found several things interesting about the Catcher in the Rye.
ReplyDeleteOne thing i found interesting was as I understand, Holden has a unique relationship with both Allie and Jane Gallagher. Holden’s relationship with Allie is especially unique because although he is dead, Holden’s thoughts are affected by his memory of Allie. For instance, when Holden sees something red like his red hunting hat, it reminds him of Allie because of his red hair. Holden remembers his brother Allie as not being a phony and in some ways he admires Allie because Holden wished to stay innocent (like a kid) and not change into a phony (an adult). Holden’s relationship with Jane is also unique because he new her when they were both younger and they spent a lot of time together. I think Holden really cared about her and that’s why he doesn’t want to see her anymore because he wants to preserve his memory of her as not a phony. Both of Holden’s relationships with Jane and Allie are important to him because thay are the two people he remembers not being phonies.
Another thing i found interesting was in Chapter 13, Holden tries to explain why he hasn’t lost his virginity. Holden claims to have had a lot of opportunities to lose his virginity. Holden also says that everytime he was about to have sex with a girl that something always prevented or stopped him from doing it. Holden said that sometimes he wasn’t in the mood so he just didn’t do it and at other times girls would tell him to stop and he wasn’t sure whether or not to keep going or really stop so he ended up stopping every time. There were also instances where supposedly the girls’ parents would come home and he wouldn’t get the chance to do it. In reality, I believe that holden never had any chance to lose his virginity because he always lies and makes up excuses plus if he really wanted to lose it, he would have done it with the prostitute later in the book.
One final thing i found interesting in the book was throughout the book, the author makes several references to the hunting hat Holden bought in the beginning of the story before he left Pencey. Although it may seem like its just a regular hunting hat with no significant meaning; I believe it is repeatedly refered to because it has a deeper meaning and it symbolizes something much bigger. In I way, the hat symbolizes Holden’s brother Allie who had past away at a fairly young age. Holden remembers his brother as an innocent person who wasn’t a phony like adults. The Hats color also has some symbolism to it because just like Allie’s hair, the hat is red. Holden repeatedly puts on the hat and plays with it because he knows he is becoming an adult (which he thinks are phonies); when holden puts on the hat he feels as if he is like Allie and not a phony. This helps Holden take his mind off the fact that he is becoming an adult (phony) and there’s nothing he can do to stop it.
-Cristobal Reyes
hey mr hartshorn, one thing i found interesting about this book was the relationship of Holden between Allie and Jane. The relationship between Holden and Allie are that they are brothers and Allie is a way of Holden to be close to his childhood. Since Allie died and stayed in his childhood years Allie was very important to Holden he really admired Allie like for example he wanted to wear red because it reminded him of Allie and his childhood memorize. Allie and Holden were very close they would always hang out and play there little kids games. The relationship bettween Holden and Jane was they used to play checkers and she would always keep her kings in the back row that was something he always remeber that. All those memorizes were tresured by Holden because now that they grew up and havent seen eachother Holden is afraid that Jane has turned in to a phony.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing i found interesting was the concern of Holden for the ducks. i think Holden is concerned about the welfare of the ducks at central park during the winterbecause the ducks sort of symbolize himself. the ducks leaving might mean Holden leaving his childhood and going to adulthood. So he worries about them because he is afraid that they dont have a place to go just like him he feels lost.
The last thing i found interesting was that there were many references about the hunting hat the way i see it was that Holden uses that hunting hat as a remebrence of Allie and his red hair also the memories he has. The hunting hat makes Holden feel safe and protected from the rest of the world. the red hunting hat makes holden feel like a kid again. the red hunting hat represents childhood the way he gives it to phoebe as a way of wanting her to stay as a little kid. the hunting hat is holdens way to link himself to Allie.
ARIANA MENDIOLA
DeleteHello mister Hartshorn, Harmony Perry here, I just wanted to comment on some of the things I found to be interesting to me in the book we read this year. In chapter two of the book on page eight Mr. Thurmer expresses the concept of life being a “game”. The way I look at things is, life is a game in which you have to “live by the rules.” When you think about it, life is sort of like a game. If you play by the rules you tend to get further than the person who objects to follow the path intended for the player. Holden was one to ignore the rules. Holden did as he pleased like a kid would. Almost like if he were a kid again. Holden did various things that he shouldn’t have such as getting kicked out of multiple schools, and pretends as if he is shot after getting drunk.
ReplyDeleteOther things that interest me is chapter nine, how Holden continuously uses the phrase that he is “not in the mood” when it comes time to call Jane. There was always an excuse. I believe for the reality of the situation to be that Holden is afraid to find out that Jane has changed. Change or growth in Holden’s eyes would be being a phony. Holden constantly avoid calling Jane because he not only fear that she might be a phony but, someone who doesn’t keep all her king in the back row and different from the girl he met that summer. On page 59 of chapter 9, Holden uses it being too late as an excuse as to why he couldn’t call Jane, but called Faith Cavendish. The difference between the two is Holden has known Faith from prior years, so she wouldn’t have significant change.
Chapter twenty-six of the book, turned out to be one of the most intriguing to me.
At the end of the chapter Holden advises the reader to never tell anybody anything, because you begin to miss them. Holden without knowing gradually developed relationships with the people he mentioned throughout the book. So at the end of it all he missed them. Although in previous chapters Holden said how much he did not like people, it’s inevitable to develop some type of feelings or liking toward people he has had encounters with. He repetitively expressed his disliking of both Ackley and Stradlater’s ways, yet he cared enough to take not of the things they did. After all Holden has been through it took for him to be stripped away from everything he had to realize we he thought was bad, was really good.
hey hartshorn- its mary toledo. i had a great joy of reading catcher in the rye in class. Although at times it had seemed strange at times there were three things that really made stop and think.
ReplyDeleteThe first point being Holden stating throughout the book that the adult world is full of phonies and they are the picture as it seems to be a wicked type of persons creating, also destroying a child’s innocence. He- Holden cherishes everything that has to do with childhood to him it’s what is good, pure, untouched by a simple cruelty as to the simplest form of innocence. It is as if almost being a child you don’t have that immediate reaction to jump up and be responsible. Holden grew up too fast too soon losing his brother Allie at a young age then having to be consumed by how his parents were dealing with it. Holden wants to be as well as protect the catcher in the rye to preserve, save along with save the children from having to face the adult world like he did.
Following this I took a quick note as to how Holden mentions but never really goes further in detail about the relationship between Jane Gallagher and her mother’s husband. It’s quite odd also puzzling as well. Jane at one point in time could have seen the booze hound as he is referred to doing something to her mother such as abuse her mother or maybe that was the something that came between her and her mother, Jane’s mother had chosen him over her real father. Then again I had to think of when the book had taken place this being a time where women were still seen and not heard, if anything were to happened shake it off powder your nose smile and be happy, Jane knew more than what she was supposed to maybe. Jane could remind her mother’s husband of a daughter he once had but lost because of his excess drinking. What and why she is really upset and scared of him we’ll never know.
As a final point I liked that just as much as Holden said he hated the adult world saying it was bad, full of phonies, just a horrid place in general- he sometimes played himself off as an adult! He even states frequently that he can sometimes act like his age or like a child, but then can go off and be an adult. It is a conflict with the constant teenage emotion of sometimes being an adult and being a teenager. Yes being a kid, growing up as a kid we all wanted to be an adult! Drive cars go to work, make dinner, become a doctor etc. but what wasn’t really told is that the older you get the more responsibilities you’re going to have. Teenagers often think they can conquer anything that they’re invincible and then us teenagers get cocky then at a certain point something anything can come along change the situation and give us a whole set of rules that we have to deal with along with a new set of responsibilities. Which as a teenager who wants to do something over when you can be babied along the way? There is often a fine line drawn to this point. Personally, growing up if you did as you were told you followed rules and what not you were fine. But if you couldn’t you had to sit through that lecture of “if you want to act like a baby then you’ll be treated like one” meaning you couldn’t do what you’d normally do. Ultimately you would be put on a restriction and schedule until you yourself could pick up the pace and fend for yourself learning the lesson of once you get knocked off your high horse don’t want to be babied or make habit of it, prove to be the adult you want to be and always keep working for it.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn. Its me Elexus Kang.:] I just wanted to discuss with you a few main topics that caught my eye throughout the book.
ReplyDeleteOne of the things that I found most interesting about Holden was his obsession with phonies. In Holden's point of view everyone is a phony except for children, because of their innocence. But throughout the whole book all the characteristics that he describes as a phony he has done once. So, while he's calling everyone a phony, he becomes hypocritical and acts like a phony himself. For example, his sister Phoebe, through his eyes shes not a phony because shes still young and innocent. Another example, was in the beginning when Holden was talking about Mr. Spencer in his mind, the opposite if his opinion would come out of his mouth when he spoke to him. This example was the first evidence of Holden acting like a phony in the book. He's a very mysterious boy due to his hypocritical mind and thinking.
Another topic that was interesting in the book was Holden and Jane Gallagher's relationship. In the story he wouldn't call her and would always have excuses like him not being in the "mood" to talk to her. He was always somehow attracted to her and grew up with her also. Holden also believed that she was an innocent women and knew that she wouldn't do certain things phonies would do. For example, when he heard about her date with Stradlater he got really curious if she gave in to him or not. When Stradlater refused to tell her Holden got very upset which shows that he cares for Jane and that Stradlater would turn her into A phony.
Holden also sees life in a whole new point of view. He believes that his role in life is to save the children of his time from becoming phonies. Near the end of the book he tells Phoebe that he wanted to stop children in a field of rye and to try to stop them from falling off a cliff. Holden is really obsessed with how the mind works and could be very intelligent. But at the end of the story he realizes that it was impossible from doing so, that everyone would eventually turn into what he calls a phony.
Hey Mr. Hartshorn! Its Jeshanah Siangio. I absolutely found the book really interesting and I'd like to share my thought about it with you.
ReplyDeleteHolden's hunting hat reminds him of Aliie, well, becuase its his! But also, he says, “people with red hair are supposed to get mad very easily, but Allie never did, and he had very red hair. He went on to say, “He was also the nicest in lots of ways. He never got mad at anybody.” means the world to Holden everything that Allie stood for to him, which is pure and happy. The hunting hat gave Holden the sensation of not being a phony, which ultimately meant a lot to him. Holden later gives the hat to Phoebe as protection to her. I think he sees the hat as protection to the both of them.
Now I find the subject of Holden's relationship with Jane is very interesting. I think that Holden just really cares about Jane Gallagher. Yeah, it seems like he wants to be more than friends, but I think he just REALLY cares about her. Holden just doesn't want his image of her to be tainted. He sees her as innocent, overall, she's still a child alongside him. He just doesn't want to know if she grew up to be a phony like the rest of them. He says, “I know old Jane like the back of my hand… the whole summer long we played tennis together almost every morning and got golf in the afternoon. I really got to know her quite intimately.” He thinks he knows her, but really, in reality, he's overlooking the fact that change is constant and that she's grown up. No one really stays the same and he can't accept that. With Sally, he didn't really care much. He did have moments where he truly did, but he did not care about her as close as Jane. Maybe when he already expected of what was to come when he called Sally and that it was okay to know that SHE changed.
According to Stradlater, good writing is simply a question of getting the commas in the right places. Well, I have a different perspective of what good writing is. Sometimes, you see those pictures where one blends in with another image that it could possibly be, like a mind playing kind of thing. When you look at it, you can't tell which one you're looking at. Well, good writing shows you what you're looking at. It leads you the way and shows you the big picture. The whole shebang. Clarity in the points that the writer is trying to show is the key. Clarity is good writing, showing you what the author is trying to say or prove.
Thanks for taking the time to read my thoughts!
Hey Mr. H its Daniel Contreras I also thought Catcher in the rye was an interesting book one thing I found entertaining was that Holden can go on lying for hours. Who is to say this story is all made up. By looking at the facts in chapter 1 Holden was describing where he was at in a mental hospital in California. This whole story could not even be true or might have even taken place at all in the story in the first place. I don’t understand how Holden hates phonies if he is one too. If Holden says he can lie for hours then doesn’t that make him a phony the same kind as the ones he points out in the story lying about what they really mean. Throughout the whole novel Holden is ether say a half lie or lying completely so what is to keep Holden from lying then and now. As we found out in chapter one how can we the readers believe anything Holden says if he is saying if the story is being told locked up in mental hospital a few years later after the events supposedly happened. To summarize this story cannot be proven true or false with only Holden narrating the story. I also found interesting was that Holden wanted to know about what happens to the duck in the winter. I believe that Holden doesn’t really care what happens to the ducks. I think that Holden is really asking the cab driver metaphorically what is going to happen to himself when he becomes an adult. To me it seems that Holden doesn’t have any idea what he is going to do. By him asking the cabdriver where do the ducks go during the winter gives him comfort in having his problem answered to reassure himself. Holden then feels it going to be okay for him the same. My other theory is that Holden asked about where the ducks migrate and the return of the ducks is like his mental problem. That his sickness may become something he needs to overcome every now and then. To summarize my 2nd theory Holden see himself in the same position as the ducks and sympathize with it. The one that got me thinking was when Holen said he doesn’t care if his parents find him at home. I believe that Holden is tired of living by himself that he is bored being alone. Holden must have realized that if he got caught at home he can at least have conversations with his family. As Holden stated in many chapters he was running out of money and would have to sleep outside parks or in a subway. When Holden was wishing he got caught he knew that his parents were going to scold him but he was going to be able to sleep in his own bed instead of sleeping in the cold. Symbolically Holden figured that if he got caught that his parents would treat him like a little kid which is what he is always talking about. I believe the Holden doesn’t apply himself in order to stay at a mind of a kid and when is parents see how bad he is doing he gets to be treated the way he wants to be. My last theory is that Holden wants to get caught because he doesn’t want to take care of himself anymore and figures that he will stay a child if he lets his parents take care of him. To summarize this Holden realized he cannot take care of himself and figures after the yelling of getting kicked out of three schools he can stay and let his parents take care of him.
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